Do the farmer bots now sell for 60-90 and the rest of the bots buy the food and not care about price...or is there shenanigans already this round?

i think early starters put food up on market and the bots buy it because its the only available food

<Market>: Apr/08/2015 12:30:31 -- Bushels -- $63 -- 1,925 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 159,927 Bushels
<Market>: Apr/08/2015 12:30:31 -- Bushels -- $63 -- 1,925 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 158,002 Bushels
<Market>: Apr/08/2015 12:30:31 -- Bushels -- $63 -- 2,895 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 155,107 Bushels
<Market>: Apr/08/2015 12:30:32 -- Bushels -- $63 -- 5,304 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 149,803 Bushels
<Market>: Apr/08/2015 12:30:32 -- Bushels -- $63 -- 9,316 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 140,487 Bushels
<Market>: Apr/08/2015 12:30:32 -- Bushels -- $63 -- 14,582 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 125,905 Bushels
<Market>: Apr/08/2015 12:30:33 -- Bushels -- $63 -- 20,650 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 105,255 Bushels
<Market>: Apr/08/2015 12:30:34 -- Bushels -- $63 -- 26,350 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 52,555 Bushels
<Market>: Apr/08/2015 12:43:23 -- Bushels -- $63 -- 988 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 77,917 Bushels
<Market>: Apr/08/2015 12:43:23 -- Bushels -- $63 -- 1,440 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 76,477 Bushels
<Market>: Apr/08/2015 12:43:23 -- Bushels -- $63 -- 1,764 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 74,713 Bushels
<Market>: Apr/08/2015 12:43:24 -- Bushels -- $63 -- 1,936 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 72,777 Bushels
<Market>: Apr/08/2015 12:43:24 -- Bushels -- $63 -- 1,380 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 71,397 Bushels
<Market>: Apr/08/2015 12:43:24 -- Bushels -- $63 -- 1,815 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 69,582 Bushels
<Market>: Apr/08/2015 12:43:25 -- Bushels -- $63 -- 1,764 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 67,818 Bushels
<Market>: Apr/08/2015 12:52:16 -- Bushels -- $63 -- 2,000 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 63,818 Bushels
<Market>: Apr/08/2015 12:53:00 -- Bushels -- $63 -- 2,000 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 63,818 Bushels
<Market>: Apr/08/2015 12:54:51 -- Bushels -- $63 -- 8,100 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 55,718 Bushels
<Market>: Apr/08/2015 12:54:52 -- Bushels -- $63 -- 12,052 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 43,666 Bushels
<Market>: Apr/08/2015 12:54:52 -- Bushels -- $63 -- 17,350 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 26,316 Bushels
<Market>: Apr/08/2015 12:54:54 -- Bushels -- $63 -- 23,050 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 3,266 Bushels
<Market>: Apr/08/2015 13:02:09 -- Bushels -- $63 -- 1,100 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 2,166 Bushels
<Market>: Apr/08/2015 13:02:09 -- Bushels -- $63 -- 1,750 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 416 Bushels
<Market>: Apr/08/2015 13:02:10 -- Bushels -- $63 -- 416 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 0 Bushels
<Market>: Apr/08/2015 13:02:11 -- Bushels -- $83 -- 2,240 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 0 Bushels
<Market>: Apr/08/2015 13:02:12 -- Bushels -- $83 -- 2,192 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 0 Bushels
<Market>: Apr/08/2015 13:02:12 -- Bushels -- $83 -- 2,412 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 0 Bushels
<Market>: Apr/08/2015 13:02:13 -- Bushels -- $83 -- 2,244 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 0 Bushels

also, looks like I shoulda farm-started

The 29$ food was an exploit anyways. You could have $80mil on turn 99 just by teching military tech with demo/ buy/resell food.

Plus- it normally starts out this way. Food is high at first, everyone then goes farmer and then it sells for 35 for rest of set.

THe bots are getting tricky, look at this one
I am not a bot do not hit (#20)

I don't get the idea of having the bots sell food at $29. 29 ×.94 = $27.2 (that's less than PM). In fact, if you're a farmer on EXPRESS you shouldn't even be selling below 40.

lol wtf. What if u have no military tech. What if you are a demo. Get real boy.

The sell price is ridiculous at $29 which is funny how this thread started off asking about high food prices. Although many strats benefit in different ways from bots farmers get the short straw and have no chance unless excessive market manipulation pushes the market high.

Currently the bots create market pushes throughout the set on various goods but the main trend is listed below

Early game the 1st 500K-1mil bushels can sell at high prices than the price tanks due bots dumping mass amounts at $29.
Following this price dump tech begins to hit the market and bots force it above 3-4K for the next 24-48hrs.
Late game because of stockpiled assets(another problem creating rich spy/farm targets) bots buyout the indy market at well above the PM rate which should almost never occur(except for at the finish to to bad calcs but still not in the quantity that sells regularily now on Sun)

At this point I'm all for the longterm develop and use of bots but they still need alot of work(adding spies, reducing on hand stock, retals, etc) and no one can win unless they take advantage of bots whether directly or indirectly.

Maybe we could start running every 3rd or 4th set as a non bot set to mix it up?

You don't need to be demo.

39*.94 = 36.6

Flooding the market with 30s bushels hurts you far more than making $2-3 extra a bushel. You have to look at it beyond short-term. And if you have no mil tech- buy some. It helps you in two ways.

naw man thats just creating an artificial shortage, that will help other farmers grow, and hurt the market long-term LOL

You're not going to do well as a farmer selling all your food at below 40 dude. <----- ON THE MARKET
The only way is to spike the food cost. That happens by selling on PM and by buying off Public.

Once food spikes, everyone panics, and all the noob farmers cash in their turns to take advantage of food spike. Then a 2nd higher spike occurs but all the farmers have cashed in their turns. That's when you sell all the food you bought at higher prices gaining 25-50% gains. There's a reason why I'm the only farmer placing t10.

i play farmer as demo, selling at below 40... such as, 35-39, will make me a lot more money than selling on private. even if i go for military tech Ima be 32-34 private market sale price for the major of the round, AND the way food cost spikes is when techers start buyinfg it, not when i sell my own food on private market. Comon!!!!

yeah there is a reason. Reason is farmer on Express is often weak, and good players aslo dont play it often. Dont get a big head. you are not #godtier

Which demo farmer is yours & which set?

All of the good ones

Yeah- that's what I thought. I sure hope they don't modify the bots. It's going to be a humbling experience for many of you.

What do bots have to do with you saying not to sell for $37 $38 $39 as demo when your private sale price is $32 or $33

Yeah- and I'm going to assume when you say good players don't play farmers you're referring to EXPRESS only. The good players obviously play Commie. It requires so much more talent. /sarcasm

commie posts higher scores so good players are attracted to it because they want to win and make high scores. Yes this is in express. Other servers can have other strats be stronger.

So with your logic, good players find easier ways to win and bad players use harder ways to win. Am I missing something here? So you're saying if a tyranny casher wins EXPRESS he's a bad player simply for using the harder way to win. To me, it's the opposite. If you win with a harder govt that's far more impressive.

When there's 150 million fewer bushels on market, food prices will ALWAYS be higher.

Im saying a good player is not likely to play tyranny casher. People who are good at netting want to maximize their net and their chances to win most of the time, and dont play losing stragedies. So, we dont play farmer on express very often.

A farmer can win. It's happened before, we just need fewer DEMOs that play like you as a farmer!

Bonus..

lol. #trickybot

Anyone know where TDA has been the last several months? He played farmer almost every set and was very good with the strat. I hope all is well with him.

That time of set where people are forced to wait on spending turns instead of paying for tech at 3.5K and over priced military. Meanwhile since the bots are still programmed to overpay and buy no matter the price sellers have zero incentive to lower the price.

Hm, the bots *do* have price tolerance functions built in now for tech...

$tol = $cpref->price_tolerance; //should be between 0.5 and 1.5
if($c->money > max($c->bpt,30)*$c->build_cost*10){ //buy_tech
	//out("Try to buy tech?");
	$spend = $c->money - $c->bpt*$c->build_cost*10;
	if($c->pt_bus < 140)
		buy_tech($c,'t_bus',$spend*1/4,3500*$tol);
	if($c->pt_res < 140)
		buy_tech($c,'t_res',$spend*1/4,3500*$tol);
	
	$spend = $c->money - $c->bpt*$c->build_cost*10;
	if($c->pt_bus < 175)
		buy_tech($c,'t_bus',$spend*1/4,3500*$tol);
	if($c->pt_res < 175)
		buy_tech($c,'t_res',$spend*1/4,3500*$tol);	
}

I'm definitely still accepting ideas & tweaking things; for the moment I haven't had time to program in additional things like GDI/Attacking/&etc, but things within the existing stuff is fairly trivial to tweak

If those prices are too *high*, that can be changed of course.

As for selling, it aims for whatever prices the market is at +/- 10-20% or something

Also, once again, I welcome code reviews:

https://github.com/jhaagsma/ee_npc

In my opinion, the best approach is to examine which govt has t5 almost every set and adjust the bots accordingly. Right now it's almost exclusively commie and almost never farmer. So I would think change the ratio of commies and farmer.

Here's the line of code:

if($cpref->strat == null){
if($cnum%5 == 1)
$conversion = rand(0, 1); <----- added
switch($conversion){ <---- added
case 0: $cpref->strat = 'F'; <--- added
break; <----added
case 1: $cpref->strat = 'I'; <----added
break; <---added
elseif($cnum%5 == 2)
$cpref->strat = 'T';
elseif($cnum%5 == 3)
$cpref->strat = 'C';
elseif($cnum%5 == 4)
$cpref->strat = 'I';
else
$cpref->strat = 'R';
}

With these added lines to ee_npc you allow a random factor of 50:50 of changing a govt which would have been a farmer to indy.

The problem with this added code- it's very possible that it still selects farmer every time during the random process, thus not changing the situation at all.

So maybe do rand(0,2) and add default: $cpref->strat = 'I'; // making it 66% chance of indy vs farmer.

hmm so you would like me to look at the previous reset's results to determine strat makeup; and make more of them do whatever the T10 averages tend to look more like?

that could end up in all sorts of multi-set oscillations heh

Yeah- true. But when you have t3 the same govt every set and the only variable that you can change are the bots, perhaps that's the way to go. Maybe make the adjustments per 3 sets rather than every set.

Chelpi I thought you told me #farmer was fine but its just only you know how to play it.

1 Nemsey Pemsey 49 33,625 acres $45,215,323 CG 1345
2 BUTTLAND 42 25,960 acres $32,941,345 CG 1269
3 Rock Lobster 79 18,742 acres $32,278,729 RG 1722

========================================================
1 password 69 30,753 acres $45,514,859 CG 1480
2 BiBiGoN 50 14,359 acres $28,355,851 D 1975 <<-- techer
3 I R WoG SuperFly 27 22,882 acres $26,235,507 CG 1147
============================================================
1 Rock Lobster 63 21,247 acres $37,903,369 RG 1784
2 The Baron 78 16,540 acres $26,754,720 RG 1618
3 man f you and ur momma 12 17,539 acres $24,968,113 RG 1424
==================================================================
1 MakeMyDay 64 18,528 acres $31,522,425 RG 1701
2 BIPPY 49 14,026 acres $26,699,432 HG 1904 <<- techer
3 Crimson 17 21,246 acres $25,201,432 CG 1186
================================================================
1 I Know How To Retal 14 31,586 acres $35,578,237 CG 1126
2 polar express 10 20,211 acres $31,304,116 HG 1549
3 Arsenal 44 25,706 acres $27,597,200 CG 1074
===========================================================
1 Thermal Detonator 5 32,475 acres $37,622,258 C 1158
2 Kingme 17 16,068 acres $28,918,411 HG 1800
3 I R WoG SuperFly 10 20,299 acres $24,833,312 CG 1223
==========================================================
1 DeathFromAbove 1 17,703 acres $34,510,413 HG 1949 <--- techer
2 Hydroponic Avocado 2 27,960 acres $33,851,037 C 1211
3 19 19,460 acres $31,939,758 H 1641 <--- techer
================================================================
1 DeathFromAbove 93 16,566 acres $38,198,118 HG 2306
2 Rock Lobster 91 19,531 acres $31,032,814 RG 1589
3 Hydroponic Avocado 6 30,589 acres $29,448,103 CG 963
=================================================================

I said you can play farmer better. But people like you flood market with 35-36 food and then bots do -10% of that so it gets stuck at 34-36 range entire set.

I think it would be cool to change font color of bots after the set is over...a reveal of sorts...to see how they measured up to some of the players and vice versa. Would be funny to see that my net was topped or my attack was DH'd by the bot.

You can only claim that if you're crest23, he's hands down the best Demo-Farmer I've played with.

+1 this idea .

I also +1 this! :)

An all explore commie could win this set. $170 units+

yea i shoulda stuck with commie :(

$32 $30 6,265,449 34,080 it seems like the farmer bots are playing like Earf would.